The AR15 thread

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Here is some.
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=133&t=420182

Correct me if I'm wrong fellas, but you can use .223 in a 5.56 rifle, but you cant use 5.56 in a .223? Thats what the guy at GanderMt told me today.

You need to vist the ORACLE and stop listening to stock boys at the deer rifle store.

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so sayeth the ORACLE said:
Q. What is the difference between 5.56×45mm and .223 Remington ammo?

In the 1950's, the US military adopted the metric system of measurement and uses metric measurements to describe ammo. However, the US commercial ammo market typically used the English "caliber" measurements when describing ammo. "Caliber" is a shorthand way of saying "hundredths (or thousandths) of an inch." For example, a fifty caliber projectile is approximately fifty one-hundredths (.50) of an inch and a 357 caliber projectile is approximately three-hundred and fifty-seven thousandths (.357) of an inch. Dimensionally, 5.56 and .223 ammo are identical, though military 5.56 ammo is typically loaded to higher pressures and velocities than commercial ammo and may, in guns with extremely tight "match" .223 chambers, be unsafe to fire.

The chambers for .223 and 5.56 weapons are not the same either. Though the AR15 design provides an extremely strong action, high pressure signs on the brass and primers, extraction failures and cycling problems may be seen when firing hot 5.56 ammo in .223-chambered rifles. Military M16s and AR15s from Colt, Bushmaster, FN, DPMS, and some others, have the M16-spec chamber and should have no trouble firing hot 5.56 ammunition.

Military M16s have slightly more headspace and have a longer throat area, compared to the SAAMI .223 chamber spec, which was originally designed for bolt-action rifles. Commercial SAAMI-specification .223 chambers have a much shorter throat or leade and less freebore than the military chamber. Shooting 5.56 Mil-Spec ammo in a SAAMI-specification chamber can increase pressure dramatically, up to an additional 15,000 psi or more.

The military chamber is often referred to as a "5.56 NATO" chamber, as that is what is usually stamped on military barrels. Some commercial AR manufacturers use the tighter ".223" (i.e., SAAMI-spec and often labeled ".223" or ".223 Remington") chamber, which provides for increased accuracy but, in self-loading rifles, less cycling reliability, especially with hot-loaded military ammo. A few AR manufacturers use an in-between chamber spec, such as the Wylde chamber. Many mis-mark their barrels too, which further complicates things. You can generally tell what sort of chamber you are dealing with by the markings, if any, on the barrel, but always check with the manufacturer to be sure.

Typical Colt Mil-Spec-type markings: C MP 5.56 NATO 1/7

Typical Bushmaster markings: B MP 5.56 NATO 1/9 HBAR

DPMS marks their barrels ".223", though they actually have 5.56 chambers.

Olympic Arms marks their barrels with "556", with some additionally marked "SS" or "SUM." This marking is used on all barrels, even older barrels that used .223 chambers and current target models that also use .223 chambers. Non-target barrels made since 2001 should have 5.56 chambers.

Armalite typically doesn't mark their barrels. A2 and A4 models had .223 chambers until mid-2001, and have used 5.56 chambers since. The (t) models use .223 match chambers. (yours is a 5.56 chamber)

Rock River Arms uses the Wylde chamber specs on most rifles, and does not mark their barrels.

Most other AR manufacturers' barrels are unmarked, and chamber dimensions are unknown.

Your rifle can fire either. I have also fired both in both if you get my meaning. Also handloaded thousands of mixed brass 5.56/223 with warm loads, some even hot. Not one case head seperation, not one pierced primer, some slightly flattened ones. I was careful but did get some good numbers. Heed the gong, not the caution fairies.
 
You need to vist the ORACLE and stop listening to stock boys at the deer rifle store.

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Your rifle can fire either. I have also fired both in both if you get my meaning. Also handloaded thousands of mixed brass 5.56/223 with warm loads, some even hot. Not one case head seperation, not one pierced primer, some slightly flattened ones. I was careful but did get some good numbers. Heed the gong, not the caution fairies.


yeah, only real concern is possible higher chamber pressures, but, surplus 5.56 is going up in price, and several brands of .223 are cheaper, so, your choice
 
There is an ex marine sniper on 97.1 right now, talking about shooting 1000+ yards with iron sights, .308 and .223.
 
Your rifle can fire either. I have also fired both in both if you get my meaning. Also handloaded thousands of mixed brass 5.56/223 with warm loads, some even hot. Not one case head seperation, not one pierced primer, some slightly flattened ones. I was careful but did get some good numbers. Heed the gong, not the caution fairies.

Gotcha. From what I just read in that article, they say the same thing, .223 is fine in 5.56, but 5.56 in a .223 can cause some pressure issues.

jsxtreme said:
Correct me if I'm wrong fellas, but you can use .223 in a 5.56 rifle, but you cant use 5.56 in a .223? Thats what the guy at GanderMt told me today.


ORACLE said:
high pressure signs on the brass and primers, extraction failures and cycling problems may be seen when firing hot 5.56 ammo in .223-chambered rifles


Don't get me wrong postban, I heed the gong. Because the gong has never steered me wrong!
 
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There is an ex marine sniper on 97.1 right now, talking about shooting 1000+ yards with iron sights, .308 and .223.

Look up "Palma Match". 800, 900, and 1000 yard shooting with irons only. I know a guy who shot it from when I was in hi-power. Same guy had the license plate "200 17x"

20 shots at 600 yds
all in the 10 ring
17 in the smaller x ring

that guy can shoot
 
I did a job for a guy out in tecumseh {i think} named George Felbaum, he had a very nice gun collection and his whole house was just filled with pelts and mounts. He had business cards that said deadly under 1000 yds. he made barrels and stuff in his basement. He shoots competition, recognize the name at all Postban?
 
one more;

Rock River Arms Entry Tactical M4
Trijicon Tripower in LaRue mount (Tritium, fiber optic and battery systems)
Troy BUIS front and rear
LaRue Low profile Gasblock
Daniels Defense QD front sling mount
Daniels Defense Ambi sling endplate
Daniels Defense 9.0 Lite rail
Tangodown VFG and Rail covers
Magpul MIAD grip
Pentagonlight MD2 Laser/Light
Rock River Arms NM 2-stage trigger

Still waiting on a Magpul UBR stock, standard M4 stock for the mean time.

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I'm running the M16 Range this weekend up at Fort Custer, 5.56 ammo cost me NOTHING....muhahahaahahah

so basically you have more AR's than you could possible need I don't like all that extra crap on my M4 just gimme the CCO and the Spot light for nighttime Urban OPs and I'm good
 
also you can use the M249 ammo which will give you extra range its got and effective range of a 1000 meters , it might increase the wear and tear on the Barrel and you will have to controll your rate of fire or you will melt the barrel, Which I've done on the M249 a few times "melted the handguards off that bitch"
 
yeah. Nice firearms. Is there any local outdoor ranges that we can rapid fire at? I hate pausing in between shots.

When things settle down a bit in the next few years I will let you bring your Weapons up to Fort Custer and you can fire all the rounds you want down range

I'll even let you fire some of the U.S ARMY WEAPONS like the 240B will make you creme on yourself!!
 
When things settle down a bit in the next few years I will let you bring your Weapons up to Fort Custer and you can fire all the rounds you want down range

I'll even let you fire some of the U.S ARMY WEAPONS like the 240B will make you creme on yourself!!

:lol: Im gonna quote that and hold ya too it!
 
:lol: Im gonna quote that and hold ya too it!

agreed

here is the lower i had, I swapped upper though

not sure what I am going to do with the top one, might cut the barrel toi a dissapator, or buy a 14.5 w/permanet MD for it

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pic sucks, but the botton is the colt lower from my fist gun, with an M16A1 upper on it, the top gun is my first colt upper(20" HBAR post ban) and a Stag lower I built w/ 4 position stock
 
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