Anyone ever use watson racing(brownstown) for tuning?

red2004 said:
You can think what you want.....I never said I was out to bash anyone or company, if you read what I said in my story about my experience with watson, I said this was just my experience with them. I had a shortblock built by a well known company, and then I assembled (with help) the rest back together, (stock heads with comp270 cams already together), eddy intake, oil pan, instelled timing chain and accesories (timing set to 0), etc....and plugged all the harnesses back together and the car started right up with no issues but a couple fuel fittings that were leaking and were fixed, then had a couple people that are experienced in these builds and there were 0 problems. Have plenty of pictures of the reassembly and have a couple videos of the car running and idling before being taken to watson. Yes I did have a problem getting the car in the trailer from it being such an incline and me not wanting to get into boost getting it up the ramp (I am overprotective of the motor, didnt want to screw nothing up) so I kept stalling it (5speed, new clutch, flywheel, quadrant, firewall adjuster, unadjusted) plus having untuned 60lb injs, maf, it wasnt a tuned car so.....shoot me for stalling it 50 times lol
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Lonny, I'm sure you HAD good intentions at First. I am just dumbfounded that you would get on a Forum and Bash, Or let your "Friend" bash a company for work that they did or didn't do.
From reading all your comments, you seem to contradict yourself many times. This usually happens when someone is trying to make things up to help their cause or avoid detection of some-sort. This post you made above has me confused as well. Let's say that in a perfect world, Watson had tuned the car and made the 550 HP you wanted....and the Clutch burned up in the process.....Is this their fault or yours? I would assume you would have badmouth'd them for doing this even though you have admitted that you took them a potentially 550HP making "Monster" with an un-adjusted clutch... I hope you see Where I am going with this.. We all know by reading this thread that some things were left out of the story, but we can make "educated" assumptions and fill in the holes. I fully understand how you might be upset with the outcome, but you must understand that the outcome is partially your doing. I for one, don't think They should have taken on the task of working on the car after looking at it with the problems they found. On the flip side to that, they spent time and someone's money to try and correct issue on your car, and you told them an Amount YOU were comfortable paying.....and then you did what I warn young people about..... You went back on the only thing that truly means anything to men...Your WORD
I have a business in this industry, and when I tell someone I will do something, or I agree to pay something, regardless of the outcome...I do it. This helps me sleep at night knowing that my Word is the Strongest thing I can offer someone. I am not here to "babysit" or give "Lectures" on life values, I am however upset that you took it upon yourself with the help of a friend to get on a public forum and tried to make a business that has been SOLID for the last 35 years seem like some "Fly By Night" shade tree Mechanic. Give them the respect they've earned and deserve...

Lastly, If there is one thing I've learned about the Hotrodding "Lifestyle", it is that there are not many "Shops" or Companies left that are willing to help the person who doesn't have 6 ZERO's in their bank accounts and I for one, would never burn a bridge as you have done in such a small Community as the Racing/Hot Rodding World.
 
bluethunder said:
For the record, I don't even Live in Michigan. I do however do business with many in Michigan. I race my car in National series and reply on places like Watson to deliver TOP notch work and Products. I'll say my peace, take it for what you want and then I'll piss off back to the world where people who actually build and drive hotrods and know what they are getting into $ wise and don't run to their wives for help...


Lonny, if this car ran so great before you took it in, why was it pushed into the shop? If this car of yours was running so well it should have be able to be driven in and parked till the tuning took place, correct.....?????

I Still say the whole story is not out there from Lonny. I am going to assume (since I do have an educated mind) that you built a half ass car in your garage with help from friends who don't know much more than what they read online and then when you though this car was ready for tuning, you trailered it in, pushed it into the shop where Watson did screw up----They should have looked at your car and helped you push it back to your trailer. These assumptions on my part could really be cleared up by your posting a picture of this "First class" build and that way we can all see this top notch mechanical work your performed and then dropped off with Watson to tune...But you won't because we all know you built some basket case and though you could drop it in the lap of a well established business and let them deal with it, and when they finally got to the point that no one wanted to deal with it anymore or the fact that you couldn't afford for someone to get it correct, you agree to pay "something you could afford", get your car back and then back out on payment and get Keyboard out to bash someone.... Does this sound about right?

Before I ever start anything, I first think to myself,,,,Can I do this? If I can't then I make sure to PAY for someone who knows what they are doing to deliver me what I wanted...
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Looks like u just joined to come on here to bash this thread good way to start!!! The thing that I feel is just stupid is watson didnt even give him a dyno sheet why cause the car didnt make the power it should and they wanted to hide it till they got paid first cause they couldnt figure it out? Whole situation is fudged up
 
90SuperchargedLx said:
Looks like u just joined to come on here to bash this thread good way to start!!!
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There are a lot of people in the industry that get really ticked off about situations like this and will go out of their way to inject their opinion. EVERYONE in the industry has had to deal with people like red2004 and are sick to death of their crap.
 
bluethunder said:
You went back on the only thing that truly means anything to men...Your WORD
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I'm not getting into this but...
This is one thing my dad taught me when I was a young brat... Each and everyday I do that... Knowing I can sleep at night peacefully and not worried...
 
I have been reading this thread from the beginning. There are mistakes a plenty on BOTH sides of this issue.
Let me get this out of the way first: I have known the Watsons (Sr. and Jr.) since Sr. was still out on the shop floor. I have NEVER known either one of them to cheat, lie, deceive, or even hedge to cover their own ass. In my experience, they have gone out of their way to deliver quality products and services, whether they were part of a contract with Ford Racing, or a guy off the street getting an exhaust on his Hot Rod. Not nut swinging. This is a fact. 35 years in the business and their word has ALWAYS been good.

That being said, there is obviously a disconnect within their new division (Watson Racing). As stand-up as they (The Watsons AND their organization) have always been, the common thread I hear about one of their employees (Who is pivotal here) makes me think that Chuck MAY not have the whole story as reported by this employee. The "repair and diagnostic" work that makes up the bulk of this dispute isn't something that Chuck actually did, it was done by one or more of his guys. HE is relying on THEM to give a clear and acurate picture of what happened. I think there may be some hedging there.

Lonny, I don't know you. I don't know what your level of experience is. From the sound of it, you're on your second build (or so) and going for the boosted application on a budget. Nothing wrong with that. BUT before you drop off a car that you JUST BARELY finished, experience will tell you certain things need to be checked out 110%. You got in a hurry to "see the numbers" that you and your buddies thought it SHOULD make. From the fact that your wife got involved in this, (Really?) I would bet there was a certain level of pressure on the homefront: "You have sunk SO much money in that car, and now it's going to be ANOTHER $800 just to get it tuned? When is it actually going to run?" (Even if she never spoke those words, a couple dozen guys reading this has heard them before!!)
You didn't want to drive the car without a tune. OK. I have taken a cam card and an engine build sheet to the tuner, and sat down and gotten a preliminary cal flashed so I could safely drive the car. NOT race it. NOT do holeshots. Safely start and run that car so ALL systems can be checked out. Did you ask about this?? Look into it next time.

I think Watson has a few communication problems, and maybe the guy doing the tuning is not all he's cracked up to be. There aren't a ton of guys running around with that skill set. As a new business venture, I'm sure Chuck hired the best people he could find. Or at least the best ones who applied. I will say with confidence: Chuck WILL take this series of events seriously and make changes to prevent it from happening again.

I read your account of things several times.
YOU, Sir. OWN the process of modifying and getting YOUR car ready for it's intended purpose. Whether that be a show 'n shine, or going for The Belt, a Wally, or Victory Lane at The Daytona 24, YOU are in charge of WHAT gets done, HOW it's done and WHO does it. From the planning, to the budget, to sourcing the parts and outside services, to maintaining it, it's ON YOU. Even if you are just a check writer with a helmet. (By the way: Watson deals with ALL of these scenarios. On the highest proffessional levels.) You let the process get away from you. It happens. It happens to the less experienced at a much higher rate than to the Pros. But, yes it happens to the Pros too. You got in a hurry, compromised the quality of what YOU did to the car, then got into a communications issue with the tuner. He then got into a communications issue with the guys around him, and it spiraled out of control. I was one of the guys who asked you how it went. I wanted to know what your experience was. Therefor, I can't fault you for reporting out. But I think you showed a little more of YOUR ass.

Take this experience for what it's worth. Don't try to do ANYTHING on your car half-assed. And don't let your wife fight your battles for you. (Really?)
 
I think Watson has a few communication problems, and maybe the guy doing the tuning is not all he's cracked up to be. There aren't a ton of guys running around with that skill set. As a new business venture, I'm sure Chuck hired the best people he could find. Or at least the best ones who applied. I will say with confidence: Chuck WILL take this series of events seriously and make changes to prevent it from happening again.

I believe this statement is exactly right. No one ever mentioned Watson before his "tuner" (who has had problems before) started working there. Hopefully things can change for them.
 
KWIK123 said:
I think Watson has a few communication problems, and maybe the guy doing the tuning is not all he's cracked up to be. There aren't a ton of guys running around with that skill set. As a new business venture, I'm sure Chuck hired the best people he could find. Or at least the best ones who applied. I will say with confidence: Chuck WILL take this series of events seriously and make changes to prevent it from happening again.

I believe this statement is exactly right. No one ever mentioned Watson before his "tuner" (who has had problems before) started working there. Hopefully things can change for them.
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agreed
 
What he said.....lol
OldbutNew said:
I have been reading this thread from the beginning. There are mistakes a plenty on BOTH sides of this issue.
Let me get this out of the way first: I have known the Watsons (Sr. and Jr.) since Sr. was still out on the shop floor. I have NEVER known either one of them to cheat, lie, deceive, or even hedge to cover their own ass. In my experience, they have gone out of their way to deliver quality products and services, whether they were part of a contract with Ford Racing, or a guy off the street getting an exhaust on his Hot Rod. Not nut swinging. This is a fact. 35 years in the business and their word has ALWAYS been good.

That being said, there is obviously a disconnect within their new division (Watson Racing). As stand-up as they (The Watsons AND their organization) have always been, the common thread I hear about one of their employees (Who is pivotal here) makes me think that Chuck MAY not have the whole story as reported by this employee. The "repair and diagnostic" work that makes up the bulk of this dispute isn't something that Chuck actually did, it was done by one or more of his guys. HE is relying on THEM to give a clear and acurate picture of what happened. I think there may be some hedging there.

Lonny, I don't know you. I don't know what your level of experience is. From the sound of it, you're on your second build (or so) and going for the boosted application on a budget. Nothing wrong with that. BUT before you drop off a car that you JUST BARELY finished, experience will tell you certain things need to be checked out 110%. You got in a hurry to "see the numbers" that you and your buddies thought it SHOULD make. From the fact that your wife got involved in this, (Really?) I would bet there was a certain level of pressure on the homefront: "You have sunk SO much money in that car, and now it's going to be ANOTHER $800 just to get it tuned? When is it actually going to run?" (Even if she never spoke those words, a couple dozen guys reading this has heard them before!!)
You didn't want to drive the car without a tune. OK. I have taken a cam card and an engine build sheet to the tuner, and sat down and gotten a preliminary cal flashed so I could safely drive the car. NOT race it. NOT do holeshots. Safely start and run that car so ALL systems can be checked out. Did you ask about this?? Look into it next time.

I think Watson has a few communication problems, and maybe the guy doing the tuning is not all he's cracked up to be. There aren't a ton of guys running around with that skill set. As a new business venture, I'm sure Chuck hired the best people he could find. Or at least the best ones who applied. I will say with confidence: Chuck WILL take this series of events seriously and make changes to prevent it from happening again.

I read your account of things several times.
YOU, Sir. OWN the process of modifying and getting YOUR car ready for it's intended purpose. Whether that be a show 'n shine, or going for The Belt, a Wally, or Victory Lane at The Daytona 24, YOU are in charge of WHAT gets done, HOW it's done and WHO does it. From the planning, to the budget, to sourcing the parts and outside services, to maintaining it, it's ON YOU. Even if you are just a check writer with a helmet. (By the way: Watson deals with ALL of these scenarios. On the highest proffessional levels.) You let the process get away from you. It happens. It happens to the less experienced at a much higher rate than to the Pros. But, yes it happens to the Pros too. You got in a hurry, compromised the quality of what YOU did to the car, then got into a communications issue with the tuner. He then got into a communications issue with the guys around him, and it spiraled out of control. I was one of the guys who asked you how it went. I wanted to know what your experience was. Therefor, I can't fault you for reporting out. But I think you showed a little more of YOUR ass.

Take this experience for what it's worth. Don't try to do ANYTHING on your car half-assed. And don't let your wife fight your battles for you. (Really?)
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sqidd said:
No one ever mentioned them before red2004 either. Just sayin.
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They have gotten into the "retail" side of things just in the past few years. This was an outgrowth of their full build and preparation of both drag and road race cars for serious, professional, and succesful race teams. THAT was an outgrowth of their being the primary fabricators of every BIW, Cobra Jet, and BOSS 302 road race car sold through FRPP since 2007. THAT came from them being metal fabricators for LOTS of parts. 35 years worth. They started out with Chuck Sr. building headers and exhaust systems. You may have Ford Racing parts on your car that were made by them, and not even know it. 2000 Cobra R exhaust manifolds?? All 300 sets fabbed by Watson.

They are not newbies!!
 
OldbutNew said:
They have gotten into the "retail" side of things just in the past few years. This was an outgrowth of their full build and preparation of both drag and road race cars for serious, professional, and succesful race teams. THAT was an outgrowth of their being the primary fabricators of every BIW, Cobra Jet, and BOSS 302 road race car sold through FRPP since 2007. THAT came from them being metal fabricators for LOTS of parts. 35 years worth. They started out with Chuck Sr. building headers and exhaust systems. You may have Ford Racing parts on your car that were made by them, and not even know it. 2000 Cobra R exhaust manifolds?? All 300 sets fabbed by Watson.

They are not newbies!!
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That's not what I was suggesting at all. I was suggesting that they have managed to do this for 35yrs without bad press (I've never heard any). Then red2004 comes along. Maybe the problem is red2004 and not Watson.
 
Not getting informed as your bill is sky rocketing is wrong. I just picked up my 04 Cobra (Procharger F1A) from Walsh and we had a ton of problems on the dyno but he called me everytime before the bill increased to inform me.
 
sqidd said:
If that is what happened...............
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Dude who the fuck are you? You have been a member since 2008 and have zero interest in contributing anything to this site until Watson gets bashed for doing shitty work, why don't you and bluethunder go get a room. Fucking trolls
 
^^^At the very least, it's in the top ten of the dumbest threads ever...:shake:

I have no dog in this fight, but I'm an old school "handle my problems face-to-face" kind of person. Things like this just drag down the aggregate IQ of MM's members...

Just my $.02....Carry on, as you were....
 
smooth said:
Dude who the fuck are you? You have been a member since 2008 and have zero interest in contributing anything to this site until Watson gets bashed for doing shitty work, why don't you and bluethunder go get a room. Fucking trolls
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I'm contributing a different viewpoint.

Are you one of those people who is cool with everyone having an opinion.............. as long as it's the same as yours?
 
Ok so if watson is good and not bad can we hear a few good stories from members who have used their services? I know their has to be a few people who have used them before??
 
sqidd said:
I'm contributing a different viewpoint.

Are you one of those people who is cool with everyone having an opinion.............. as long as it's the same as yours?
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No...he's the kind of guy who will drive 30 minutes out of his way to drop off parts to other members. Give you a deal, lend his help and or advice. That's why there's rep points above our avatars...
 
hangemhigh said:
No...he's the kind of guy who will drive 30 minutes out of his way to drop off parts to other members. Give you a deal, lend his help and or advice. That's why there's rep points above our avatars...
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He sounds like a great guy. Too bad that has nothing to do with my question.
 
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