Let The Rebuilding Begin...AGAIN!

littlemissGTO

littlemissGTO

Club Member
Yes, you read the title correctly. Here's the back story. In late 2008/early 2009 I had the engine in the GTO rebuilt because I spun two connecting rod bearings. Fast forward to about a month ago and I'm starting to get all kinds of issues with the car.
Driving down the highway at cruising speed, I noticed that the CEL started flashing. I thought, "Why the hell is this thing going into catalyst protection mode?" Mind you the flashing was very intermittent. When I got home I checked for codes and there were none. So I put that little bit of information in the back of my head. The next day I head out and I notice that the temp gauge is acting funny. So I knew that I needed to check the thermostat. No biggie. On my way home I got the flashing CEL and a "check oil" message. The check oil message came on for a brief moment. When I got home I checked the oil level and it was fine. The next morning, I swapped the thermostat thinking that was the cause of the CEL. I went to visit a friend at his shop and the damned "check oil" message came on again. So while I was there I had him order me a new sending unit. Get that swapped out, and test drive the car. The same freaking message came back. I started hunting for a bad ground because the message never came on under the same conditions. Sure enough, I find a bad ground and repair it. I start the car let it idle for a little bit, bring the RPMS up and HP Tuners is telling me at at OT I've got 6 psi of oil pressure. According to GM, that is within spec. LOL
So I install a mechanical gauge and it's reading 12 psi of oil pressure. I'm thinking okay I've gotta replace the oil pump. No problem, I ordered one just in case. For shiggles I put 20w50 oil in the car to see if the pressure would come up and it did not. So the next day I start the oil pump install. I get that done, and I'm thinking okay all is good. I can make my trip as planned. On start up with 20w50 the pressure is reading 38 psi. Not stellar, but I'm confident that the issue is fixed. I take the car for a test drive and the damned check oil light comes back on. Now I'm pissed and I know that somewhere internally the car is bleeding off oil pressure. The most common culprit are the cam bearings. Okay, the engine has to come out of the car. I can deal, but this is not what I was planning on.
So I have the car towed to a friend's house and we get to work on getting the engine out of the car.

That's my brother from another mother with his head stuck in the engine bay. :)

The next day the engine is loaded up and the fun begins.

Now when I realized that I had to pull the engine to fix what the issue was, I prepared myself for the worst because you just never know. Boy am I glad I prepared myself for the worst case scenario.
Look at the intake ports of my heads, my engine is a giant oil pump instead of an air pump. :thumbsdow

If you've seen and heard the car at the WDC lot, you'd know that I've had noisy lifters, well I found out exactly why one lifter was so freaking loud.


Mind you this lifter has made noise since the day I installed the rebuild in the car.
Okay, I'm over that. I knew I was going to have to order new lifters anyway no biggie.
 
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Here's what the tops of my pistons look like:


Holy buckets! Actually they cleaned up really well. I'll get photos of them later.
So the moment of truth comes when we pull the camshaft out.


Okay, so I'm going to need a new cam to. I can live with that. The cam bearings were given a quick look, and then I got pissed at the engine builder.


So let me get this straight, you can't clean the block before you assemble it? Alright cool. I should mention that when I had this engine rebuilt I paid for and handed him ARP fasteners for the cam gear and an ARP balancer bolt. When I did the oil pump swap I noticed that they were not installed. I began to wonder what else hadn't been installed that I paid for. So I when I pulled the pan off I was really glad to see this.
Now here come the real fun part. I start removing pistons and rods and I am completely disgusted. Keep in mind that I bought coated main and rod bearings.

 
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More rod bearing carnage:


I happened to notice as I was taking the rods and pistons out of the block, that my crank had not been balanced. Now everyone knows that when you change rods and pistons you balance that stuff. I went from factory rods and pistons to forged rods and pistons. I know from my project at school that there is a huge difference in weight on just the pistons alone. Why the hell would you not balance my rotating assembly? I'm paying you for it. I am livid at this point, but things just keep getting better.

Notice the marks on the caps? Yeah, they had been going for a ride. Now, you guys are probably wondering if I noticed this, and the answer is yes. In the upper RPM range the car had a vibration, and I really didn't know what it was. I was pretty sure it wasn't the driveshaft because it's a factory driveshaft.
My crank and cam are going to become pieces of furniture.



I called the builder and asked who he had do the machine work, and I told him I wasn't happy with what I found. He basically tried to tell me that I don't have any idea what happened and that all of the machine work had been done. He didn't have an answer for me when I asked why the rotating assembly hadn't been balanced. He demanded to see the bearings, so I sent him the photos you see here and I have not heard a word back from him. Gotta love that huh?

This engine had roughly 70,000 miles on it. 85% of those miles were highway miles. I never took it to the track and raced it because I was always afraid of blowing it up. I'm also very glad I didn't put a blower on it. I'm sure I wouldn't have gotten 100 miles out of it if I had. Did I mention that it took 8 months to get this build done by this joker?
So my plan now is to build a 402. I won't have to worry about the quality of the build because I will be doing the work.
Here's where I'm at now. The cylinder heads have been disassembled and I've done the trunion upgrade on my rocker arms.



 
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I also just figured out that I can add more than 10 pictures to a post. Game on!
Cylinder head disassembly

The valves got removed and cleaned up:




The cam bearings make me ill.




I got all of the plugs out of the block and put it in the washer. I'm surprised at how light this block is.


Just one more thing I'll have to take care of before assembly starts.

The mains, look at the lovely marks from the caps moving.

Tuesday I will start align honing the block. That is going to be interesting because I've never done an aluminum block and neither has my brother from another mother.

Christmas has come early to my house. UPS and FedEx are going to get a workout. I may have to give the driver that delivers the new crank a gift or something...LOL
So far here's what I've got my grubby little mitts on





Friday I will order the crank, rods, bearings, seals, head gaskets, valve seals, and new injectors.
 
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05cesrt said:
Damn, all I hear nowadays is shifty chassis builders and shotty engine guys. Sure glad I'm too poor to build anything yet! Sorry to hear
Now why not just do a 6.0l block swap while your at it? Unless your GTO already was a 6.0l then nvr mind.

....... http://detroit.craigslist.org/mcb/pts/4071786529.html lol
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Sadly, I didn't know any better when I chose this guy. Lots of people in my GTO club said he was good and I took their word for it. Look at what that's cost me. Fortunately I went to school to learn how to do this stuff and I'm going to make sure it's done right this time.
My GTO started life as a 6.0L. :)
 
If you turned 70k miles I'd say the build worked out OK...not great though... A 402 with what cam specs? Something in the 240 duration range? It'll be sweet! Any head work? Goodluck, we love the progress pics!
 
AutoRoc said:
If you turned 70k miles I'd say the build worked out OK...not great though... A 402 with what cam specs? Something in the 240 duration range? It'll be sweet! Any head work? Goodluck, we love the progress pics!
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I should have pulled it apart as son as I found out how bad of a tune he put in it. One thing is for sure, he'll never touch anything I own ever again.
Cam specs are 239/248 .623/.596 113+3. I will be hand porting and polishing my stock heads as well as my stock intake. Maybe I'll get lucky and find a set of L92 heads and an intake for next to nothing.
 
That is pretty shitty. Atleast you know now that everything will be done right. I'm in the same boat, but I'm having all my machine work done by a shop since I don't have the equipment in my basement lol. I will be assembling the engine myself though, along with checking clearances and closely inspecting everything that the machine shop is doing to my small fortune worth of parts. Nothing like dropping off $5000 worth of parts to a machine shop and the owner rolling the parts in the building and almost seeing your $2000 cylinder heads hit the concrete. Luckily I was there to do a diving catch, but it sure didn't give me a warm and fuzzy feeling about leaving my stuff with them. Hopefully you have much better luck with the new build!
 
SuperStang90 said:
That is pretty shitty. Atleast you know now that everything will be done right. I'm in the same boat, but I'm having all my machine work done by a shop since I don't have the equipment in my basement lol. I will be assembling the engine myself though, along with checking clearances and closely inspecting everything that the machine shop is doing to my small fortune worth of parts. Nothing like dropping off $5000 worth of parts to a machine shop and the owner rolling the parts in the building and almost seeing your $2000 cylinder heads hit the concrete. Luckily I was there to do a diving catch, but it sure didn't give me a warm and fuzzy feeling about leaving my stuff with them. Hopefully you have much better luck with the new build!
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How in the Sam hell do you not balance a rotating assembly? I'm sure you will have better luck than I did. Don't fret too much.
Falcon64 said:
Just curious did he use arp bolts on the rods?
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ARP fasteners came with the rods, and they were there.
 
I'm not sure how LS engines are built from the factory, but with Ford 302's they are imbalanced with 50oz, which in turn does not require a balance job. Only Neutral setups require the balancing. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure thats how that works
 
SuperStang90 said:
I'm not sure how LS engines are built from the factory, but with Ford 302's they are imbalanced with 50oz, which in turn does not require a balance job. Only Neutral setups require the balancing. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure thats how that works
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50 ounces? Goodness.
1BADAIR said:
Did you pay for balancing?
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Sure did. I also paid for the mains to be align honed and they were not.
Just so you guys know, the builder that did the work isn't located in MI. He's in MO.
 
SuperStang90 said:
I'm not sure how LS engines are built from the factory, but with Ford 302's they are imbalanced with 50oz, which in turn does not require a balance job. Only Neutral setups require the balancing. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure thats how that works
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...you still need to balance if your upgrading pistons or rods or both.....
 
damn man, good luck im doing a few builds right now for customers and would never even think about doing something like that to somebody..
 
ls1sleeper said:
damn man, good luck im doing a few builds right now for customers and would never even think about doing something like that to somebody..
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The silver lining is that I get to do the work this go round, and I have no one to blame buy myself if something goes wrong. The messed up part is that I've still not heard back from the builder after I sent him photos of the bearings. Oh well, such as life.
SuperStang90 said:
Not necessarily if the pistons and/or rods are the same weight or close as the ones that are getting replaced..
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There was a significant difference in weight of the new rods and pistons versus the stock stuff. Heck I went from a .944 wrist pin to a .927 wrist pin. The new rods were lighter than stock as well. The rotating assembly should have been balanced period.
 
I swear when I set foot in the shop I step into a time warp. Tonight I put the oil pan, valve covers, front and rear covers, and the pick up tube in the washer. While that stuff was washing I disassembled the oil pump to make sure it didn't have anything to eat, and thankfully it didn't. It only has like 10 miles on it.



I measured the valve guides and noticed that they were not all the same, so the old ones will be knocked out and new ones installed. I also took a look at the exhaust ports on my heads. Yeah, I've got some room to work with when I start porting them.

I thought this was a neat shot.

I got the mains torqued down and measured. There was very little if any taper and they all were within spec. So they were checked to see if they were level with each other, and they were not. They weren't off by much, but that will be fixed.


On tap for tomorrow evening: cutting main caps, getting the mains squared away, and getting the valve guides out of my other head.
 
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